W
WB6WSN
Guest
<table lang="SV" style="tab-interval: 65.2pt" vLink="blue" link="blue" bgColor="white">
<font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<blockquote dir="ltr" style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black">From: Bo Strander
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">To: amphicar-lovers@yahoogroups.com
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 AM
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Subject: SV: [amphicar-lovers] Re: Amphicar fire gas and oil - bilge blower addition
<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Perhaps a little other discussion, but:<o
></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Does anybody have any experience with cooling the <span class="SpellE">oilcoler</span> with sea-water? <span class="GramE">Or perhaps a seawater cold silencer?</span><o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Just an idea ? maybe it could help those of us that tend to have a little high temp in the engine bay?..<o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">From a still snowy, -10C </span></font><st1:city><st1lace><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Stockholm</span></font></st1lace></st1:city><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">.<o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Bo the swede<o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB"><o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB"><o></o></span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN-LEFT: 65.2pt"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">----<span class="SpellE">-Ursprungligt</span> meddelande-----
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Fr?n:</span> WB6WSN [mailto<span class="GramE">:wb6wsn</span>@cox.<span class="GramE">net]</span>
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Skickat:</span> den 24 november 2004 11:15
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Till:</span> amphicar-lovers@yahoogroups.com
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">?mne:</span> Re: [amphicar-lovers] Re: Amphicar fire gas and oil - bilge blower addition</span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN-LEFT: 65.2pt"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o></o></span></font>
<font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font></blockquote>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">That's an interesting concept. Now these are just musings; the existing Amphi water and oil cooling systems are reasonably adequate for most times. But, what if..........?</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">The Amphi engine works hardest when you are in the water, and that's just when you are going the slowest and getting very little cooling help from the wind. OTOH, when in the water, you have a very nearby and handy thermal mass that's an infinite heat-sink. So how do you get excess engine heat into the water?</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Some boats use sea-water cooling, where they pump water, in a single pass,through the engine and then dump it (often into the exhaust manifold, where it cools the manifold and exhaust pipe and also acts as a quasi muffler). The catch with this system is that it leads to deposits and corrosion in the engine, especially for salt-water boats.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Some boats use fresh-water cooling, where they have an automotive type of coolant flowing through the engine and then into a heat exchanger. An auto radiator is really a heat exchanger too, moving heat from the liquid coolant to the outside air. In a marine heat exchanger, sea water is used in place of the air, and the heat moves from the closed coolant system to the throw-away sea water. The catch with this system is complexity and cost, and the heat exchangers need periodic attention.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">The Amphi allows for an unusual third option. The Amphi hull is a large expanse of thin steel, which is a moderately good conductor of heat. (If you don't believe me, try grinding the end of a bolt while you hold it!) If we could somehow transfer engine heat to a moderately large area of the hull, the heat would be sunk by the mass of outside water.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">I don't think that this is a viable idea for replacing the normal air-cooled radiator, but I think this would work very well for the oil cooler. Ideally, an oil cooler would route the hot oil through a serpentine tube in intimate thermal contact with the hull. Tubing is cheap and, once installed, maintenance free. The only problem is good thermal contact with the hull steel.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Anyway, dumping engine heat by cooling the engine oil is a real good idea, since the oil quality degrades if it gets too hot. And the time when you can transfer maximum heat from the engine (with hull exchange) is just the time when the Amphi engine is working the hardest and getting the least help from the external air-cooling system.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Ed
El Cajon, CA USA
67 Rust Guppy
</font>
<font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<blockquote dir="ltr" style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----
<div style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black">From: Bo Strander
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">To: amphicar-lovers@yahoogroups.com
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 AM
<div style="FONT: 10pt arial">Subject: SV: [amphicar-lovers] Re: Amphicar fire gas and oil - bilge blower addition
<div class="Section1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Perhaps a little other discussion, but:<o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Does anybody have any experience with cooling the <span class="SpellE">oilcoler</span> with sea-water? <span class="GramE">Or perhaps a seawater cold silencer?</span><o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Just an idea ? maybe it could help those of us that tend to have a little high temp in the engine bay?..<o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">From a still snowy, -10C </span></font><st1:city><st1
lace><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Stockholm</span></font></st1lace></st1:city><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">.<o></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB">Bo the swede<o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB"><o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="Arial" color="navy" size="2"><span lang="EN-GB" style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-ansi-language: EN-GB"><o
></o></span></font><p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN-LEFT: 65.2pt"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">----<span class="SpellE">-Ursprungligt</span> meddelande-----
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Fr?n:</span> WB6WSN [mailto<span class="GramE">:wb6wsn</span>@cox.<span class="GramE">net]</span>
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Skickat:</span> den 24 november 2004 11:15
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Till:</span> amphicar-lovers@yahoogroups.com
<span style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">?mne:</span> Re: [amphicar-lovers] Re: Amphicar fire gas and oil - bilge blower addition</span></font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="MARGIN-LEFT: 65.2pt"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o
></o></span></font><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font></blockquote>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">That's an interesting concept. Now these are just musings; the existing Amphi water and oil cooling systems are reasonably adequate for most times. But, what if..........?</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">The Amphi engine works hardest when you are in the water, and that's just when you are going the slowest and getting very little cooling help from the wind. OTOH, when in the water, you have a very nearby and handy thermal mass that's an infinite heat-sink. So how do you get excess engine heat into the water?</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Some boats use sea-water cooling, where they pump water, in a single pass,through the engine and then dump it (often into the exhaust manifold, where it cools the manifold and exhaust pipe and also acts as a quasi muffler). The catch with this system is that it leads to deposits and corrosion in the engine, especially for salt-water boats.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Some boats use fresh-water cooling, where they have an automotive type of coolant flowing through the engine and then into a heat exchanger. An auto radiator is really a heat exchanger too, moving heat from the liquid coolant to the outside air. In a marine heat exchanger, sea water is used in place of the air, and the heat moves from the closed coolant system to the throw-away sea water. The catch with this system is complexity and cost, and the heat exchangers need periodic attention.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">The Amphi allows for an unusual third option. The Amphi hull is a large expanse of thin steel, which is a moderately good conductor of heat. (If you don't believe me, try grinding the end of a bolt while you hold it!) If we could somehow transfer engine heat to a moderately large area of the hull, the heat would be sunk by the mass of outside water.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">I don't think that this is a viable idea for replacing the normal air-cooled radiator, but I think this would work very well for the oil cooler. Ideally, an oil cooler would route the hot oil through a serpentine tube in intimate thermal contact with the hull. Tubing is cheap and, once installed, maintenance free. The only problem is good thermal contact with the hull steel.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Anyway, dumping engine heat by cooling the engine oil is a real good idea, since the oil quality degrades if it gets too hot. And the time when you can transfer maximum heat from the engine (with hull exchange) is just the time when the Amphi engine is working the hardest and getting the least help from the external air-cooling system.</font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4"></font>
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Times New Roman" color="#0000ff" size="4">Ed
El Cajon, CA USA
67 Rust Guppy
</font>
